It seems to me that in America there’s been a teensy bit of media revisionism around “Ice Ice Baby”. Unlike most revisionism though, the idea isn’t that the track was a lost classic. No, the point is to suggest it was extreme in its badness, superhumanly awful, one of the worst records ever – it shows up on lists of same and at the culmination of one Vanilla Ice himself arrived and staged a burning of the master tape. “Ice Ice Baby” was so terrible it had to be put beyond use – wiped out like smallpox, to use a simile you can imagine the man himself rapping, in that jabby monotone of his.
The effect is to suggest that Vanilla Ice’s career was a collective moment of madness, a huge “What were we thinking?”, and to cover over the fact that Occam’s Razor had it right the first time. Vanilla wasn’t promoted as a novelty, wasn’t sold as one, wasn’t really bought as one. The thing that made him different to most of the lame MCs around at the time – and pretty much all the good ones – was the thing he helpfully pointed out in his name.
And as everyone said at the time, 25 years after Elvis the biz still needed a white guy to sell a black sound. This was a little unfair, and not just to Elvis: rap was mainstream with or without Vanilla Ice, and his album replaced MC Hammer at the top of the US charts. More telling, though, was that “Ice Ice Baby” was the first hip-hop Billboard #1 single – a position determined by airplay as well as sales, so one more reflective of tastemaker conservatism. The wider industry was comfortable with the notion of a white rap superstar, and never mind that he was no good.
There were elements of that attitude in his UK success too. But over here, more credible hip-hop tracks never had much chance of reaching #1 – from the mid-80s you’d find rap singles bouncing around the lower 20s, but it was always the gimmicky stuff that sold, and in a UK context Vanilla Ice really was just another novelty. In fact “Ice Ice Baby” seems like a kind of culmination of all the Euro-rap, pseudo-rap, gimmick movie tie-in rap – some good, some not – we’ve seen feature in Popular through 1990.
That doesn’t make it anything other than a feeble record. But it’s not an all-time stinker. It rests on a very strong idea – nicking the “Under Pressure” bassline and placing it under dessicated beats creates a mesh of malevolence a good storyteller could make a lot of. It’s such a strong idea that with half an ear – heard in snatches on the radio or on the Chart Show – you might think Vanilla Ice is that storyteller. And then you listen a bit closer.
The Iceman ruins the record in three different ways. There’s his flow – all those big end of line stresses are fine when he hits on the occasional decent image (“like a pound of BACON”) but they gum up his storytelling and make it hard to follow. So the track is rhythmically monotonous, and then his tone is unvarying too: he has a constant undertone of weaselly aggression. “Ice Ice Baby” is mostly brag with a side order of narrative, but even the bragging needs some kind of charm and variety to work – and the tone makes his party and gun talk rote and unengaging too. And then there’s the most serious issue – Ice just doesn’t seem in control of his words. He’s careless with metaphors – “flow like a harpoon daily and nightly”; “my style’s like a chemical spill” – wait, how is that good? By the third verse he’s rhyming poet and know it, drawing attention to it with those bloody line-ends, and any goodwill created by his sample choice is long, long gone. Though to be honest you could have given up at the very start – what on earth is “collaborate” doing aside from fill up syllable space?
So what were we thinking? Vanilla Ice sounds like a man who likes hip-hop but can’t do it very well, and the track’s success here isn’t just down to his race. “Ice Ice Baby”‘s very clumsiness is what makes it accessible – a big friendly sample, an easy to imitate flow, no great technical skill. It comes at the start of a period that’s the pop equivalent of the public’s switch from beer to wine in the 70s. Some oenophiles knew what they were doing and bought accordingly, but the mass market for wine was built on the likes of Blue Nun and Black Tower – Dubonnet at a pinch – and from there began a gradual climb to relative sophistication. Similarly, there would come a time when hip-hop – or at least, records that would have been impossible without hip-hop – would dominate the UK charts. But not at once, and not without a lot of education. Vanilla Ice is part of that – his unpleasant white whine is pop’s Liebfraumilch.
Score: 3
[Logged in users can award their own score]
Oh yeah, Vanilla Ice stabs at the very heart of the notion of “keeping it real”…with a spoon.
Correction corner:
a) “flow like a harpoon daily and nightly”; “my style’s like a chemical spill” are surely similes! Not saying they aren’t rubbish.
b) Dubonnet isn’t strictly a wine, its one of those apertif’s which is fortified wine with gubbins in it.
c) “his unpleasant white whine is pop’s Liebfraumilch” – I don’t get to say this very often but, IN THE BIN TOM. (Bin end)
For me, the “Worst Record EVAH” canard overlaps with contemporaneous movie “white dad rappin'” reactionary comedy bits: haha he’s trying to be intimidating and is going on about guns, when he’s clearly not even BLACK.
About two months ago I witnessed a karoake performance of this that was… interesting to say the least. They had the first line down pat, and the “check out the hook” bit, but the rest just didn’t work. You could say much the same thing about the original song I guess.
Anyway this is missing the point which is that I went up next and did a version of “I Want To Know What Love Is” which retroactively obliterated all previous versions from history
PS was “Rapture” the first american hiphop #1 or am i displaying shameful cultural ignorance
Well done for not mentioning Jedward…
I have the whole LP somewhere — I reviewed it for City Limits. I must relisten!
Mr Xhuxk Eddy, for it is he, is more fond of V.Ice than many iirc. But I’m not sure I’ve ever read his justification of this position.
Jesus God, there’s *four whole minutes* of this dull stuff. I remembered that Vanilla Ice’s lyrics were unedifying and that his style was unengaging, but I was hoping for something in the way of musical variation as the thing carries on and on…
I can report that Vanilla Ice was treated with complete derision in my South London comprehensive by all and sundry at the time. I always liked the story about touts outside his Wembley Arena show failing to sell tickets for 10p in early 1991.
#2 Watch: A week of Madonna’s ‘Justify My Love’. Sizzling!
TOTPWatch: Vanilla Ice performed ‘Ice Ice Baby’ on the Top Of The Pops transmitted on December 6 1990. Also in the studio that week were; Twenty 4 Seven Featuring Captain Hollywood, The Farm and Cliff Richard. Mark Goodier was the host. This was the 1400th edition.
Light Entertainment Watch: Three UK TV appearances of Vanilla Ice are listed;
THE SMASH HITS POLL WINNERS PARTY: with Jason Donovan, Phillip Schofield, Craig Maclachan, Betty Boo, Partners In Kryme, Monie Love, Snap, Roxette, The Boys, Vanilla Ice (1990)
WOGAN: with Jeff Goldblum, Vanilla Ice, Molly Parkin (1990)
WOGAN: with Vanilla Ice, Nesta Wyn Ellis, Helen Mirren (1991)
“Worst song ever” meme also has to be kind of a knee-jerk crowd-pleaser joke that just works generationally – – this song was huUUUUUUuuuuge in the US at exactly the right time (in terms of demographic generation-bubbles) for millions of people to be cutesily embarassed about it later. I was of the age where this was performed on stage at elementary-school talent shows and it was, at least for about four seconds, seen as genuinely “cool” in my peer group. I was a couple years too young to really get that rappers were “supposed” to be black but I think Alan Connot @ #3 is dead-on when he says that this is a big part of the song’s punchline quality.
The funny thing to me is the comparitive erasure of “U Can’t Touch This,” which I *never* hear, or even hear *discussed*, despite being seemingly as ubiquitous at the time and considerably more enjoyable as a recording. Hammer’s fashion gets a shoutout from time to time but that’s it. I guess it kind of still helps to be a white rapper, even if the mechanism of that help has sort of inverted itself.
Would definitely rather hear “U Can’t Touch This” than “Ice Ice Baby,” but as I’ve said way back when on this site, I’d rather hear “Ice Ice Baby” than “Under Pressure” so who knows…
re #8 but can Madonna ever justify her (brief) love for Rob Van Winkle (call him by his real name)?
VI was quite charmless and clunky but somehow this was always a fun rap-along both then (certainly big in my playground) and now (its persistence as a meme, still turning up in adverts etc.). The cuteness of the sample seems to have saved it for me to the extent that I might even double Tom’s score but its recent rather unwelcome and unnecessary revival knocks it back to a 5. I wonder tho if he was the first rapper to wear a suit (albeit without the jacket) in his video?
Another problem w/it is that despite being built on (a facsimile of) one of the most iconic basslines ever the bass on it is PUNY – and he’s from Miami isn’t he? Shame on him. But I didn’t want to mention this in case it was just bad MP3-itis. Has anyone heard it on something relatively boomin’ lately?
I guess it’s defend Hammer day. #12 Was Vanilla Ice the the first rapper to wear a suit? No, Hammer dressed as a gangster in the Turn this Mutha Out video in 1988, and I’m sure Big Daddy Kane’s leather suits predate it also. And #11 I guess you don’t go to Oakland Athletics games, they still play U Can’t Touch This.
“U Can’t Touch This” is from memory very fine pop-rap. Would have thoroughly enjoyed it at #1 I think.
The white rap issue is a thorny one, when many consider that white artists rode on the coat-tails of their black contemporaries. But this is a common misunderstanding, when in reality white rappers skip over the non-newtonian fluid of black culture, that is if they stand still too long, they tend to sink without trace, but if they keep running and stay ahead of the pace, they succeed. So the Vanilla Ices and Everlasts are literally swallowed up, but the Eminems and Beastie Boys endure, by not trying too hard to be “blacker than thou”. Maybe even this is being oversimplistic, but the core of white rap’s credibility is the question of authenticity. It was the biggest problem I had with rap, as a genre in the 90’s and going forward.
So many great lines to choose from. If his rhyme was a drug, he’d sell it by the gram! As opposed to the kiloliter or something!
#16 problem being too much concern with authenticity?
#17 IDK by the pill or ounce or he’d offer it on prescription maybe?
I was struck the other day listening to the first Ultramagnetic MCs album by the thought that maybe he was trying to sound a bit like Kool Keith? Except KK’s line endings are generally really effective, often dummying the listener, whereas Vanilla just comes over as a pedant: “I go crazy when I hear a CYMBAL / And a hi-hat.”
The chart for December 1 1990 reveals that ‘Ice Ice Baby’ was one of 12 rap singles (perhaps stretching the definition in places) in the Top 100 that week;
13. Dream Warriors – My Definition Of A Boombastic Jazz Style
21. Dimples D – Sucker MC
31. Monie Love – Down To Earth
32. Betty Boo – 24 Hours
41. LL Cool J – Mama Said Knock You Out
48. Run DMC – What’s It All About?
67. MC Tunes – Primary Rhyming
71. Tairrie B – Murder She Wrote
81. World’s Famous Supreme Team – Operaa House
88. Hi-Tek 3 featuring MC Shamrock – Come On & Dance
90. Rebel MC – Comin’ On Strong
In any just world, ‘Mama Said Knock You Out’ would have been number one for four weeks.
I seem to have forgotten MC Shamrock.
Tom you are joking aren’t you ? – “cooking MCs like a pound of bacon” is rightly derided as one of pop’s worst lyrics along with Desree’s “I’d rather have a piece of toast”.
I seem to remember Ian Dury wore a suit of sorts for “Reasons To Be Cheerful Part 3”
#10 Billy, didn’t this take off on the back of the Smash Hits Poll show after being around for a while ? An indication that exposure on other shows was becoming more important than TOTP.
I would be remiss if I didn’t include a proper link to Trotters’ remix, “Ice Ice Bacon.”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N6C0ai74Xo4&feature=related
#22 no it’s good! maybe i mean memorable image rather than ‘decent’, but it’s also about the only time in the whole song he actually extends a simile (sorry pete) beyond one line!
Hhmm he’s good bad but he’s not evil.
2 British female rappers in the top 40 20 years ago – not sure there’s been that many at once since….where are the current lot then? how long are we going to have to wait before we get a chart topping female equivalent to all the current pop-grime lot?
@ 18 Yes, it’s a worrying blindspot of mine. I’d love to accept “Ice Ice Baby” as a harmless bit of pop fun, albeit rather clumsily delivered by Mr Van Winkle, but it smacks of exploitation in the crudest sense. He comes across as a pawn in a much greater game (if the Suge Knight story is to be believed), and how his record label attempted to weave a street-savvy backstory around him, as if it was necessary for him to be accepted within rap as a whole. He supported MC Hammer on tour and was on the Stop The Violence roster. However, his relationship with his label broke down as soon as the press found inaccuracies in his concocted biography. This must have been a factor in his attempted suicide, after his acting career stalled. I genuinely feel sorry for the guy, when so many have tried to make him appear to be something he wasn’t.
#22. The single had been released in America in August, was top of the Billboard chart by the beginning of November and was released in the UK at the end of November. Increasing British public awareness of the Vanilla Ice phenomenon rocketed the single to enter the chart straight in at number three, followed by a month at the top. So it might have been around for a couple of months, but by the time it was commercially available it was already a big hit.
I find it hard to get excited by this – or to work up much hatred either. Vanilla Ice seems like an apt description.
Tom – 35 years since Elvis, surely.
A brilliant review. The intrinsic charm of the record is indeed the choice of sample, which works really well and distracts attention away from the record’s many flaws. Listening again, after all of this time, it’s so kind and succinct to think of the record as “hard to follow”. I thought that maybe listening closely and with a bit more experience of the world than I had then, it would be pretty easy to figure out what he’s on about. But no, not really. I really did try to stop, collaborate and listen, but I was quickly bemused and went back to thinking about why it became popular. 4.
From memory, the success in the US was augmented by a lot of pre-release publicity – and the video and dance routine seemed to capture the public’s imagination. I am sure it got a slot on Juke Box Jury, and a female reviewer (I don’t remember) swooned at the video. Whilst this sample of one could not have propelled the record into the Top 3, her reaction wasn’t untypical. The public seemed primed to buy, and so it proved, as the first of the following to facts illustrates:
ChartWatch:
When it entered the chart at #3, this was the highest debut of any act in the 38 year history of the singles chart!
For EIGHT weeks, the chart run of Ice Ice Baby was exactly the same as it predecessor, Unchained Melody: 3-1-1-1-1-2-2-5.
Another track I simply can’t remember ever being at number one – in my head, it stalled at number two (yes, insert the obvious “Freudian slip” gag along the lines of “well, it did always seem like something rather more unpleasant you’d find in a toilet” here).
I haven’t listened to it in years, and having gone back to Youtube to give it another try, I’m surprised by how bad it isn’t, actually. It’s not a work of genius and it certainly didn’t deserve to be number one or even a top ten hit, but there’s a likable minimalism to it, a hypnotic groove which – if you ignore the clumsiness of the delivery – just about propels everything along enough to be a reasonable distraction. It’s also not the worst rap I’ve heard this week, to be fair. There are plenty of supposedly semi-credible or cult underground hip-hop figures in London who deliver their work with more clumsiness than Mr Ice here, and if compared to the previous hip-hop number one we had about those pesky turtles, it’s certainly more memorable.
I obviously remember this being greeted with nothing but derision at school at the time, but there was one classmate who stubbornly stood by Vanilla Ice, to the point where it began to seem ridiculous (and I think in the end he did begin to heavily indulge in the irony and wind-up power apparent in defending the work). I’ll always have pleasant memories of him desperately trying to veer the conversation on to Vanilla Ice whenever anybody brought up anything remotely credible, then making up increasingly ridiculous arguments to defend himself and the artist. He moved on to The Justified Ancients of Mu Mu in the end. I suppose that made a strange sort of sense.
I’ve never had to cook bacon in any form other than pre-rashered, but it seems like the best line to me.
Slightly darker and certainly less humdrum than I remember. Obv the hook is done and dusted before VI even makes an appearance, which – like a bunnied ad-related hit by a Black Country idiot a few years hence – was all it took to get to no.1. It felt like VI was a bit of a laughing stock from pretty much the get go, even amongst Smash Hits writers and readers.
But MC Hammer is the best comparison to draw. Who’s worse? Hammer is certainly the more fleet-footed rapper but U Can’t Touch This was way less imaginative than Ice Ice Baby – he nicks the Superfreak hook AND feel, adding bugger all beyond the title. Imagine if this had been VI’s breakthrough – it would surely have been regarded as cultural theft (as opposed to plain laziness). At least Ice Ice Baby adds the intriguing synth chords – thin, but suitably icy.
In weak (ie tipsy) moments I’ve got a cheap laugh by saying “please Hammer, don’t hurt ’em” in a West Country accent.
Re 32: did this schoolmate go on to make any records? Is he in Scooter?
In the US, this song blew up through a minor, pay-request (hence manipulable) jukebox, music video channel called The Box. The record had been rejected for its poor audio quality by radio and the horrible vid. wasn’t close to being good enough for MTV (which still played vids at the time). Anyhow, the massive success of the song against these sort of odds and headwinds was impressive and baffling in equal measure.
Jane’s Addiction is out with Been Caught Stealing at this point (and was an instant consensus party classic), Alice in Chains’s Man in the Box similarly has been out for a few months , although I think in both cases the vids didn’t hit MTV until early 1991. And of course there was excellent slamming pop-dance around from Janet Jackson, C&C music factory and others (even Hammer so long as you didn’t have to look at him), so it seemed a little perverse for an audience to positively seek out and form around Ice in the way it did. The guy got a frickin’ movie out of this one song. And recall that Ice reverse-engineered rather than sampled Under Pressure and then insisted to the press (when asked about it) that his bass-line was really quite different from UP’s. One wanted to strangle the guy (at least if one was male). The whole thing was just groanworthy (a la Bieber now perhaps). Hence the probably exaggerated ugly cultural revenge against Ice that’s been exacted since. Here’s the famous flip out with Jon Stewart, Janeane Garofalo etc. in 1995. No one came out of that looking good.
Anyhow, particularly in the context of the more freak-showish UK charts of Bombalurina and Jive Bunny, Ice ice baby doesn’t look or sound quite so bad I agree! So, yeah:
3
#12. Yep, for me the only reason Mr Van Winkle is noteworthy is that his appearance in the Sex book marks the exact point in time when Madonna became uncool. So while she still had some great music ahead of her it was clear that she had if not exactly lost it, at least seriously mislaid it.
Justify My Love was, for me, her best record since Into The Groove. I could enjoy it without necessarily thinking about her Ice thing or Sex, the latter of which, looking back, was an astonishing move – not necessarily a good one but, sweet jesus, what a thing to have to follow.
Been Caught Stealing is even less convincing an r’n’r lifestyle rockah than Primal Scream’s Jailbird, and Alice In Chains are proto Nickelback. I’d much rather have Ice Ice Baby than either.
“It seems to me that in America there’s been a teensy bit of media revisionism around “Ice Ice Baby”. Unlike most revisionism though, the idea isn’t that the track was a lost classic, the point is to suggest it was extreme in its badness, superhumanly awful, one of the worst records ever.”
To be fair, this makes more sense in America, where we don’t have things like Jive Bunny or Bombalurina.
@wichita, 37. I’m shocked: I thought everyone loved Been Caught stealing! And while I understand that few people love AiC as much as I do; Nickelback, that’s harsh! At any rate, I cited those two cases just to emphasize that there was a real sense of thrumming excitement in music at the time as the whole Lollapalooza/Alternative Nation stuff was about to bust loose.
I’ve seen my brother attempt this at kareoke, so it deserves a four for allowing that experience alone.
It’s not that bad. The rap is, as you say, clunky and badly-stressed, but at least he sounds as if he *likes* the genre. I also have a kind of sick admiration of the way he tried to go to court to prove the bassline wasn’t “Under Pressure”, blessim.
I remember people thinking it was ok until they saw the video with his ridiculous froofy shirt and little waistcoat. More of a 90s boyband outfit than streetwear.
Word to ya mother, heh heh heh.
#12 – here’s Kane wearing suits in 1988: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M4Bx7R0LKx0 and 1989: http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xl4e1_big-daddy-kane-smooth-operator_music – the latter opening with a no-jacket iteration, too.
When the Bloodhound Gang recruited Vanilla Ice for a relatively hard-hitting duet on their second album, lead Hound “Jimmy Pop” couldn’t help himself from undercutting the appearance by introducing, in a wavering schoolboy voice, “Yo! Bloodhound Gang and Rob Van Winkle, together on this track…”
“Word to yer mother” was the bit that rankled me the most. It’s “Word to the Mother” as in motherland as in Africa. That he may have changed it on purpose does not mitigate the deed.
Tom asked if he was from Miami – actually that was another piece of the controversy in the US. He led everyone to believe he was from Miami though he had spent about five minutes there and was actually from Texas.
Well, you can all say what you want, I still love it. After #1 after #1 of slow, fairly dull if tuneful ballads, finally a reminder that yes it is 1990 after all. We haven’t had a number 1 sounding this current since, erm…well, since ‘Turtle Power’, but anyway.
It seems like it’s really only in the last couple of years that this song’s become so well-known again. Back in 2008, at a club playing ‘Under Pressure’ I ironically shouted “ICE ICE BABY” over the top and absolutely no one got it. Whereas a couple of weeks ago at a friend’s birthday, it’s this that played instead, and everyone was amazed at how many of the lyrics I knew.
And I suppose it’s Jedward that brought it back, doing a comedy cover of this mashed up with Under Pressure last year (with Vanilla Ice himself!) that got to #2, and since then it’s been in Glee and a Halifax advert. Yeah, it’s cheesy, but it’s cheesy in a good way, and even though it came out when I was 2 there’s something rather pleasantly nostalgic and adorable about it, sounding so hard to be cool yet coming across as a little kid trying to act all grown up. Rather than annoying, it’s cute.
And I absolutely love the contemporary Vanilla Ice interview when he denies he nicked the Under Pressure riff. “No, see, theirs goes ‘do do do dododo do, do do do dododo do’ and ours goes ‘do do do dododo do, DO do do do dododo do’, there’s a big difference”. I think Ice later admitted he was joking, but it’s still hilarious.
Coati Mundi rapped in a suit in 1981.
Pigmeat Markham rapped in a suit in 1968.
No Pigmeat promo videos though.
Yeah, that’s a bummer. There’s got to be a Laugh-In clip of it floating around somewhere…
I think it’s possible that its fame may divide along generational lines – I was 15 when it came out, and I think I’ve heard it quite regularly since (including possibly at Tom’s club!)
I’m also a little shocked at the score, I thought it’d be an easy 7-8: a well put together record, with lines as full of thrillpower as a lot of euro-rap that got an easier time of it, and that has brought a lot of joy to people then and since.
(what is ‘collaborate’ doing there = it’s being the Collaborate in “Stop! Collaborate and Listen!”, one of the most recognisable record openers even (again for people who were about my age when this came out))
Has Tom coordinated his timing to cross-promote with a certain ITV celeb show featuring VI?
Re: I’m with Wichita on both of those – Been Caught Stealing was one of those songs widely popular with my fellow students at the time that drove me mad, right up there with the Wonder Stuff’s Size Of A Cow and The Levellers’ diabolical One Way.
Back to Mr Van Winkle, I seem to remember there was about a week or two when there was a certain amount of debate about whether Ice Ice Baby was any cop or not – and then the consensus among people I knew/respected tipped towards the conclusion of rubbish.
On the white rapper front, nobody has mentioned 3rd Bass, who at the time of Ice’s rise would’ve been held as showing how it could be done (their flows being rather more fluid – as it were – than the Beasties*). Not sure how well their records have aged, mind. (& Pete Nice wore suits).
*Don’t get me wrong, I love Paul’s Boutique.
3rd Bass’ finest hour – there’s a lovely bass line. As bonus, those with a passing interest in underground hip hop get to see what future mysterious metal masked rapper MF Doom looked like when he was young and innocent.